Victim Mentality

Admin Joined : 16 Aug 2007 Posts : 232

Hi all,

The following is just something that I have been mulling over in the last few days.

I've been thinking recently about the common origins of many RBSD/SP practitioners.

When I read the backgrounds of many instructors I see an origin based in victimisation. Many of the people who offer training do so with the background of having prevailed against persecution, violence and aggression.

I see many many advertisements with the rhetoric that person x was bullied, abused, attacked etc then learned how to protect themselves. As a result they also have a desire to share this knowledge with others. I admire their courage and don't doubt their sincerity but my question is whether they are best placed to be instructing others in self protection?

Are they best placed emotionally, physically and mentally to provide this information?

Is this desire to pass on what they have learned another step in their personal healing process and not necessarily geared around the presentation of quality information? In short, is their desire to teach physical skills a personal re-enforcement of their status as a non-victim?

Are people who have been victims of abuse, aggression and violence in the best place to emotionally and mentally to provide objective advice on handling conflict?

Would students be better placed seeking someone who has not fallen prey to a predator in their lives and who has successfully negotiated conflict without failure?

I just wonder if this is an extension of the selling point of insecurity that I see as prevelant in the self protection industry. i.e. scared people lacking confidence gravitating to self protection from a place of negativity rather than positive change in their lives and I wonder how healthy that mindset can be?

The more I think about it, the more I consider that this is at the heart of the issue that the combat sport practitioners have with the self protection practitioners. They see insecurity instead of strength, prey looking to become predators and all too often seeing the same cracks in that prey's armour the original predator did.

I mean no disrespect to anyone at all, it's just a thought I had about how important the mindset is when approaching teaching or practising martial arts and self protection.

I'd be very interested to hear other thoughts.

Joined : 15 Aug 2007 Posts : 35

I'm definately one of those.

I had a rough time as a kid.

However, that sent me the other way for a while. In my late teens and 20s I was a complete tool wrt getting into scraps I should have avoided.

That also led me to do lots of other 'high risk' activities in the name of my ego. Both in and out of my job I pushed the envelope.

It's only now in my 40s do I feel confident enough in my abilities, and in myself, to be a good instructor. I can advise people the 'best' path to take cos I've done both (with varying degrees of success!!)

I don't think teaching has been particularly cathartic, but being pounded in the bulletman suit definately has been. There is a kind of 'no mind' state that you get to once you get good in the suit. All the BS of life falls away, all the trivial mindgames that people play etc etc. When I mention this to people, they often nod indulgently, but it's hard to truly understand until you've spent the time in there.

But I can see where you are coming from mate. I think insecurity shows itself in all walks of life. Sometimes the loud ones, sometimes the quiet ones, but always the ones that feel the need to prove. The combat sports have their own set I think.

I sometimes also think though that it might be a statistical anomaly given that something like 1 in 3 are survivors of some sort of trauma. Therefore the odds are the 1 in 3 of the SP guys will be too. Maybe we just notice when they talk about it.

The other thought that I often use is that it is OK to model on the toughest instructor you can find, but does that person truly understand how to teach ordinary folk - or do they just teach people like themselves. One of the biggest issues I have with the combat sports/MMA is that they can become a little exclusive. The people being taught are often the people that need it least. How many 16-24 year old women are there in those classes, how many 40 year old mums, how many balding 50 year olds with onset diabetes, how many grans and grandads.

A few to be sure, but not that many. But those are the people that need SP training most.

Great topic mate.

Joined : 17 Aug 2007 Posts : 36

As a non-martial artist - so I see from the outside - I think you have something there, Chris.

As a general question: What sort of person do you find seeking martial arts training?
Is it it the kid who is a natural fighter?
Or is it the non-fighter who wants to assuage insecurity and defend themselves from the many arseholes in society?

Subject: Re: Victim Mentality Wed May 28, 2008 10:51 pm

Hi Chris,

You have definately outlined one section of the community however there are of course many other instructors who have arrived on the scene via a different route.

Myself for instance, I did not suffer a great seal of bullying (four older brothers saw to that) I dabbled in karate as a kid but did not have the will power to commit to things, it was'nt until I had kids and the wanted to do martial arts that I got involved, eventually they gave up and I kept going in a very traditional system, then I saw "The pavement arena" tapes advertised and developed an interest, when I took over the club I decided to go the self defence route.

Now being aware that I had some skills but not the experience of conflict and fear management I took myself off to meet Geoff T and Peter C, I got myself along to a Dave T seminar, I think the last one he did in Edinburgh and it's gone on from there, through the BCA I got hooked up with Dennis Martin and through Den I have met and learned from many great guys .

The key is this [b]I continue to seek out people who can teach me[b] any instructor from RBSD, sports MA or traditional arts must resist the temptation to sit back and be a big fish in a small pond, the only way forward is to keep learning no matter what door you arrive through.

Alan

Joined : 17 Mar 2008 Posts : 22

Very thought provoking this is.
I took up the arts to learn how to fight better yes as a kid i was bullied by much older kids (i was very big for a young lad). And i wanted to know how to hurt them i was driven by revenge. The arts taught me to be nice and humble (you can get alot more done this way) but i never lost my fascination with the brutal part of what we do i still have it today. Yes when i watch a clip on youtube etc it does sicken me to see this but if i am honest i will watch it several times and find myself analysing what the people did.

In my experience its hard to find a good instructor who has had the predator mindset from day one. From the people i know in my life if they could have a fight from a young age they often turned into ego driven twats a bit later in life. They only calmed down when they became a victim.

To get the balance is tricky

Dave